2014 Marzocchi 380 C2R2 fork and Moto

Marzocchi recently presented their new downhill fork and shock at the Sea Otter Classic, here is an introduction by Marzocchi's Simone Bassi via Sicklines.com

380 C2R2

The “380” is Marzocchi’s all new flagship downhill model and brings together 2 years of racing development to produce Mazocchi’s modest advanced racing suspension fork to date.

The hart of the 380 is the new semi-closed C2R2 Dynamic Bleed Cartridge, this is a high-end evolution of the already market proven CR damper which is in turn derived from Marzocchi’s motorcross technology. 

note: tape was just to cover the oil 'ejection' port, so it didn't squirt anybody!

The cartridge features a one-way seal at the base to allow oil to enter and a flow hole at the top to expel any excess, keeping the cartridge always at the optimum oil level. At the top of the oil chamber is a compensator piston that works against a small coil spring, when the internal pressure becomes too high, the oil compresses the compensator piston exposing the flow hole and the excess oil is expelled. This design keeps the oil flowing through the fork to help lubrication (like an open bath design) and keeps the air outside the cartridge for more precise damping control and to eliminate cavitation (like a closed).

Damping is controlled via a new three stage compression circuit with separately adjustable high and low speed compression and high and low speed rebound adjusters. The compression group can be removed from the cartridge with the cartridge and fork still installed to the bike, making track-side damping modifications a possibility.

Stanchions are 38mm internally tapered with Nickel plating. The Nickel plating actually strengthens the alloy stanchions by 30% enabling the stanchions to be made lighter for the same given strength.
The new lower crown is machined hollow saving 40g over the existing 888 crown.

crown is cut-away to show the hollow cavity 

New lowers have been designed to be both 26” and 650b compatible and feature a new flattened arch to increase stiffness and save weight. The axle pinch bolts now use a replaceable alloy insert to prevent damage to the lower leg by over tightening.  The axle itself is now internally tapered (saving 30g) and features a key way on one end meaning you only need one tool undo it.

Specification

Travel: 200mm

Weight: 2850g/ 6.28lbs

Damping: C2R2 Dynamic Bleed Cartridge

Adjustment: High and low speed compression, high and low speed rebound , pre-load

Spring: Titanium coil, K5.5

Stanchions: 38mm nickel plated, internally butted.

Steerer: Tapered or 1”1/8 AH

Axle: 20mm taperwall

Moto 380 C2R rear shock

The goal for the Moto shock was to produce one of the lightest and most adjustable long travel coil shocks on the market. 

Weighing in at just 369g (241 x 77mm, no spring or reducers) the Moto uses a unique one piece alloy 14mm shaft and head, not only does this eliminate the weak spot (in all shocks) it saves weight also. Damping is controlled via separate high and low speed compression adjusters with the complete compression group designed to be easily removable for tuning.

The moto also features externally adjustable low speed rebound damping with the possibility to internally adjust the high speed rebound circuit.

Specification

Size: 267 x 89mm, 241 x 76mm, 222 x 70mm.

Weight: 369g (241 x 77mm no spring or hard ware)

Adjustment: External high and low speed compression, low speed rebound + high speed rebound via shim setting, pre-load.

Availability September 2013

55RC3 long term

I have been using the 55RC3 Ti fork now for a few years and I thought I would share my experience of using this product on a long term basis.

My fork is a 2011 160mm 'purple' edition, before this model I had the 2010 version and the only reason for the upgrade was because I could!

I first tested the RC3 at the Marzocchi 2010 press launch in Lake Garda, June 2009. I had the fork fitted to a Corsair, bike was brilliant, the downhills were just crazy...

Marzocchi press launch, Lake Garda 200

After the Garda 'experience' I got hold of a purple 55 for myself, fitted it to a Labyrinth demo frame and headed of on a bike trip to the Pass Portes and Les duex Aples (2010). The performance of the fork just blew me away, previously I had the 55ATA (not so good...) and a Z1RC2 (wish I kept this one). Set up wise I was using a very low speed compression bias. Alpine riding is all about the front end, your always pointing down, all of your weight is on the fork, your braking and there are rocks everywhere.  Low speed damping keeps the fork propped up and ready for the next obstacle, and in the Alpes the next obstacle will be soon!

Pass Portes 2010 - Les Gets

In Chatel we hooked up with a Marzocchi pal, who showed us a trick to up the performance further still. Read here for the foam ring trick.

The following years (2011) cycling trip was to Suisse Normande, the style of riding here is more enduro with a good mix of climbing as well as descents. The fork stayed in the Alpine set up and ate everything I could throw at it. Not only is the 55 a capable DH fork but you can all-day XC on it also....

next stop is the bottom of the gorge! 

2012 road trip was back to the Pass Portes, the 55RC3 is the default for this type of environment. 

Pass Portes 2012 - Les Gets

2012 and all our riding group are now running on RC3's.... Four of them are even purple!

55 team Suisse Normande 2012

Marzocchi's concept of open oil bath, coil spring and downhill damper is inspired, all of these forks are running and feeling box fresh, even after some serious abuse all without a single service. I cant think of many products that offer this type reliability and consistent high level of performance? Of course this concept was now new, you can trace it back to the 1997 Z1 bomber....

My current 55 is now 2 1/2 years old and I am thinking about swapping out to the 2013 model, the newer model gets the V2 piston and EVO valve out of the 888. My sponsored guys that are using it are reporting that the performance has been upped again! Or maybe I could just use the one I got for another year... including a gravity enduro race and another French trip... 

The legend: 1997 Marzocchi Z1 Bomber

The 1997 Z1 changed the way we rode bikes, and for me personally was the most influential piece of bicycle kit I ever bought.

1996 style, proflex and Z1...

Pre-Bomber forks were skinny, in-active or just plain unreliable. Marzocchi's previous model fork was called the DH3, which in function terms was brilliant once you fitted the optional coil spring kit. I remember at the time you used these or Judy DH's, but the Judy's sealed plastic cartridge used to explode as soon as you looked at them so the DH3 got the nod, but with just 3" travel and skinny legs the Z1 was a big step forward.

Z1 vs DH3

The fork was for the model year 1997, so that’s on sale time of September 1996 - to summer 97. Pre-production models featured STEEL stanchions and were very heavy and were given to a select few to race on, including Rob Warner.

Z1 prototype

check out Rob Warner in Kaprun, 1996, Britain's and Marzocchi's first world up win on the Bomber Z1

The production fork featured twin formula standard disc mounts and an optional canti support (pictured). The pre-load adjusters were round and the cartridge tops, plugs and adjusters were quite tall which could sometimes foul the downtube of the frame they were fitted to. For 1998 this model became the Z1 Alloy and featured new low-profile top caps and adjusters for better frame clearance.

2007 Z1 Bomber

Reviews of the time were extremely positive, winning many magazine awards and fans along the way.

What mountain bike test

MBUK award now lives on the wall of the gents...

Z1 poster still on our office wall!

Internal wise the Z1 featured twin adjustable rebound open bath cartridges, twin coil springs with adjustable pre-load. It may sound over built by today's standards but these were built for hard use and built to last with many forks still being used today.

exploded diagram

Here is the full catalogue specification in Marzocchi's own words.

1997 Z1

Moto X cartridge serves as the Bombers hart n’ soul. This ‘open bath’ hydraulic cartridge directly descends from our famed Magnum moto fork. The revolution is the most reliable & sophisticated cartridge ever designed and here’s why;

• Internal oil pressure is eliminated which makes seal failures a thing of the past.

• All alloy CNC cartridge assembly.

• Infinitely adjustable “speed sensitive valving”.

• CNC alloy pre-load adjuster.

• Seal-less ‘no blow’ cartridge design.

• Large oil volume for quality damping performance.

Open Bath Design

• Cartridge sits in a bath of oil keeping it cool & eliminating damping fade.

• Oil keeps the fork feeling buttery smooth & stiction free.

• Oil circulates from the cartridge leg into the leg via a high-pressure valve.

Coil Springs

• 15mm pre-load adjustment.

• Non – temperature sensitive.

• Extremely durable long life.

• Superior sensitivity & hyper-speed reactivness.

• Lightweight open wound design.

• 3 spring rates available (soft, medium, hard).

• Easily interchangeable.

Specification:

Weight: 3.9lbs

Travel: 100mm/ 4”

Function: coil & hydraulic design. Dampers: dual open bath cartridges control compression & rebound fully adjustable. Springs: coil spring, open wind, 15mm pre-load, 3 available.

Steer tube: Easton EA70 alloy.

Stanchions: 30mm Easton alloy, hard anodized.

Crown: Forged T-6 alloy, CNC machined & polished.

Arch: Forged T-6 alloy, CNC machined, removable brake hanger.

Sliders: Marzocchi cast alloy.

Length: 473mm/ 18.6”

Colour: Tangerine dream orange.

                               catalogue page

Marzocchi factory trip 2013

On Tuesday the 5th of March we headed off to visit Marzocchi in their home town of Bologna to see what they have been working on for the past 12 months and also to see what they have planned for the future.

entrance to marzocchi.com

A little background to what has been going on. Last July (2013) Marzocchi’s fork assembler (Suntour) ceased production of all Marzocchi MTB forks, this news came somewhat abruptly and caused many problems and industry rumours. However with the help of Marzocchi’s parent company (multibillion dollar company Tenneco) they made a new long term strategy and investment to create their own factory and re-start production. To enable production to continue while the new factory gets up and running Marzocchi have already invested $1m in new tooling and assembly line in an existing assembly partner, Hodaka. Hodaka have an extremely high reputation for quality and already assemble the Roco rear shock line.

some classic's and prototype parts

We got the factory around mid-day and after a catch up with all our friends and colleagues we took some time looking at their ‘classics’ collection and the many prototype components they have in the offices. It is always great to be reminded of the vast and rich contribution Marzocchi have made to the mountain bike market over the years. Marzocchi have always produced motorcycle suspension and entered the MTB market back in 1991 with the original idea to do so coming from a Dutchman! Obviously the game changer was the ‘Bomber’ and it was really cool to see they still had the prototype Z1 with steel stanchions that was raced to glory by riders such as Rob Warner.

prototype Z1 Bomber, note steel stanchions

We also looked in depth at a motorcycle project that offers fully electronic active damping; this is something usually reserved for modern sports cars (sport mode button). Marzocchi’s system makes micro adjustments in compression and rebound damping in response to the terrain with a 10 millisecond response time and is fully user customizable using an ipad app – ground breaking stuff on two wheels!

Marzocchi still make lots of motorcycle forks for BMW, Ducati and MV amongst others...

We also ventured in to the MTB testing department. This is where every detail of the fork gets tested to all the current safety standards, in fact Marzocchi test well beyond the limits of their own products as safety has always been in the forefront of their designs. Here is where all the competitors’ products are also bench marked, it is vitally important to know what other suspension brands are doing in order to make sure your own is competitive performance wise.

At the 2014 meeting we spoke extensively about the new product range, which unfortunately I cannot go it to any details here, but we have seen it along with a 2015 concept and what I can tell you is that they have something very special in the works!

Ok here it is, but dont tell anybody I showed you....

UPDATE: Pinkbike exclusive on the new downhill fork and rear shock: READ HERE

sorry not yet...!

We spoke at some length about Tenneco plans and strategies, budgets and quality control. We had a look at the motorcycle plant where quality is measured in PPM (parts per million), the Bologna factory has now been running at ZERO PPM (for rejects and failure) for two months, which is an insane by anybody’s standards. This gives you an understanding of the QC that Tenneco insist on and what they expect in their new MTB factory.

Tenneco is a manufacturer so it is only logical that they want to make their own products so the budget of $2.5m is already in place for the new Marzocchi Asia factory. Marzocchi also now have complete control over the entire supply chain and can manage and monitor every single component. The goal of all this is to completely control every aspect of the fork production to ensure every fork performs and lasts as Marzocchi intended.

Lastly Marzocchi are also very proud that all the design and engineering is done in house in Bologna and that they have never had any forks or shocks designed out-of-house. It is also worth noting that none of the engineering team have left the company, they are all still there!

Our lasting impression of the trip is that Marzocchi are very positive about the future. They are now back in production with a very high end assembler, they have budget for future growth and new factory, they have a passionate and talented team and lastly and most importantly have some great products!

Get to the Marzocchi booth at The Sea Otter Classic for a 2014 first look!

As a foot note a Bologna Airport had a stunning 25th anniversary lamborghini Countach on display, part of another local company’s 50th birthday celebrations…

Lambo!

the old blog is dead, long live the new blog

With Posterous (or more accurately twitter) deciding to close there doors and delete all accounts on the 30th April I have had to switch blog providers. I have now moved a lot of the important posts, such as recall notices plus posts that you might find interesting. The old blog with all of its posts is still on-line here http://danjones.posterous.com/ plus I have all posts backed up so I can still access them even after Posterous closes.

The bike routes blog has now moved here: http://bikesandroutes.blogspot.co.uk/

The Marzocchi workshop blog can be found here: http://marzocchiworkshop.blogspot.co.uk/

Mountain Cycle San Andreas and me

Original advert, note the fork and disc brakes!

There have been many things written about the Mountain Cycle San Andreas, pioneer, classic, icon, while all of these are true they have been extensively written about before, so here is only a brief history lesson.

Mountain Cycle was formed by Robert Reisinger and unleashed the San Andreas in 1991. He brought for the first time a monocoque full suspension frame with adjustable sub frame, suspension fork and disc brakes. Just one of these would of been remarkable but all of them together... 

The San Andreas first came on my radar when a UK journalist called Paul Smith had one, it featured as a full page poster in MBUK and was/is the only picture of a bicycle I ever had on the garage wall. I loved the fact it looked like a 500cc GP motorcycle with the engine removed, ultra tech and ultra cool in a world full of steel rigid bikes.

In 2003 the company for which I work became the UK distributer for Mountain Cycle, so I had to have one. We sold the frame set in two guises, DH with a 190mm eye to eye shock (Van R or Van RC) or XC with a 165mm (Float RL or X-Fusion). So a San Andreas XC in red with an x-fusion coil shock (cheapest option) came my way.

My first San Andreas, note 'official' VPS shock position

When we took over distribution of Mountain Cycle the production had just moved to Kinesis USA, but most importantly all of their frames were all still hand made in Mountain Cycle’s traditional Portland home. The frame featured an up-rated cartridge pivot bearing, a new VPS new shock shuttle and was compatible with a new bolt on fork stop to prevent damage to the frame caused by triple clamps.

How Mountain Cycle described the San Andreas at the time (1993). “The most versatile all-mountain high-performance frame in the mountain Cycle line. The legendry San Andrea is the bike that started it all. Twelve years after its introduction, the classic design is optimized, refined, and in high demand. The San Andreas can be built up as a lightweight yet extremely durable 4.5 inch travel XC bike, or as an all-mountain machine with six inches of travel.”

At the time there was a very negative magazine test, mostly targeting the high b/b height. Being a US made bike it was actually designed that way for rock clearance, however this felt a little weird for the UK tester... This led me to experiment with the VPS shock mount to see if I can ‘iron’ out some of the frames weaknesses and to get it to handle more like the UK norm. The official MC line at the time was that the bottom two holes were exclusively for the shorter XC shock, while the upper two holes were for the longer DH shock. In the owner’s manual it did actually say not to use the upper holes with the XC shock, but I thought that if you could it would lower the b/b height to a reasonable level...?

I proposed my idea directly to the factory and they replied that they could not see any reason why you could not use the XC shock in the upper shock mounts, so they told me to have a play to see what happens!

VPS mount top hole, 165mm shock

I ended up at the highest shock hole with the smaller 165mm shock; this dropped the b/b to 13” and slacked the head tube to a more stable angle with a 100mm fork. For me this gave the best compromise and is a set up I would whole heartedly recommend to try, the bike will only have 4 ½” of travel but the improved handling will by far compensate for this. Another set up option that works well when using a 140mm travel fork is the second hole from top with the 165mm shock.

I sold my San Andreas and moved on to other things, but the bike always had a special place in my personal cycling history... Until one night on the internet I spotted a dealer selling a new-old-stock 2003 model on clearance, the price was so cheap it was insane, I had to have it. I rebuilt the bike using the same ultra-rare Marzocchi RAC carbon fork for a modern take on the original ‘Reisinger’ look. I will never sell this bike; it is now part of me.

One new upgrade I have made that makes a massive difference is to swap out the old FOX Float to a ROCO Air LO, more modern damping keeps the back end in check and because the ROCO is a low pressure unit it has enabled me to lose about 50psi of pressure.

In summery the San Andreas is now old tech, it has a high pivot, it bobs a bit and doesn’t have much travel ... Of course none of these matters, cycling is about much more than that. In a world of big corporate cycle companies with instantly forgettable models the Mountain Cycle San Andreas still stands out today as something very special.

note: 140mm fork set up, VPS mount second from the top, 165mm shock

singletrack hunting

What's better than one San Andreas? Two!

Marzocchi's RC3 forks, 5 years of winning!

Marzocchi’s core product has always been open bath cartridges and springs. This has been the winning formula that was first used in the original 1997 Z1 Bomber, before that in Marzocchi’s motorcycle product. We have always believed in this concept as we like the non-existent service routines, buttery smooth ride and amazing grip. It’s also nice to see the magazines that matter agree with us!
Here is the roll of honour (and this is just the UK!)
2009 – 55 RC3, Dirt 100
2010 – 55 RC3 Ti, Dirt 100
2010 – 888 RC3 Ti, Dirt 100
2011 – 44 RC3 Ti, Dirt 100
2011 – 55 RC3 Ti, Dirt 100
2011 – 55 RC3 Ti, Singletrack Recommended
2011 – 888 RC3 Ti, Dirt 100
2012 – 44 RC3 Ti, MBUK Best Trail Fork
2012 – 55 RC3 Evo Ti, Dirt 100
2012 – 55 RC3 Evo Ti, MBUK Best Hardcore Fork
2012 – 55 RC3 Evo Ti, Singletrack Recommended
2012 – 888 RC3 Evo V2 Ti, Dirt 100
2013 – 55 RC3 Evo V2 Ti, Dirt 100
2013 – 888 RC3 Evo V2 Ti, Dirt 100